Moily says UPA committed to Women's Bill in present form

Law and Justice Minister M. Veerappa Moily in an interview with journalist Karan Thapar on CNN-IBN on March 14, 2010.

Union Law and Justice Minister M Veerappa Moily today said the Congress party and the ruling United Progressive Alliance (UPA) Government led by it was totally committed to the Women's Reservation Bill in the form it was passed by the Rajya Sabha.

"And, at the same time, we are not shutting down the process of parliamentary democracy for consultation, discussion, (at) any stage," he told journalist Karan Thapar on the Devil's Advocate show on CNN IBN tonight.

He also made it clear that consultations and discussions did not mean that a minority, a few people, could "bulldoze" the Bill.

Asked what the purpose of consultations was if the Government was not prepared to amend the Bill, Mr Moily said, "See, in a parliamentary democracy, a majority cannot bulldoze the minority. At the same time, the minority cannot take undue advantage of bulldozing the majority opinion. This is the basic principle."

At the outset, Mr Moily agreed with the questioner that reserving 33 per cent of the seats in the Lok Sabha and the State Legislative Assemblies might not be ideal way of increasing the number of women Members of Parliament (MPs), but it was inevitable.

He cited the examples of different countries which had tried out different ways of solving the problem and felt that none of them had proved to be ideal solutions.

Mr Moily admitted that men would have to yield some space to women in the proposed 33 per cent reservation but denied it was unfair. "No. Where is the fairness? Is it not unfair, all these 62 years, to deny and make the women represented only 11.2 per cent," he said, referring to the low share of seats that women have got in successive Lok Sabhas.

He said the issue had to be seen from the women's point of view and stressed that, unless this kind of a Constitutional amendment was done, there would be no real increase in the number of women MPs.

He also said that the Bill was not something that was thought about abruptly and traced its history from the days of then Prime Minister Rajiv Gandhi and then the reference of the first amendment Bill to the Parliamentary Standing Committee. He said the present Bill was the fourth one to be introduced in Parliament.

He said the Bill had been discussed by the standing committee and debated across the country and was the result of a national consensus. He said that the Parliamentary Standing Committee had, ultimately in their wisdom, found that the proposals in the bill were the best solution.

Asked about the problems likely to caused because of the rotation of seats reseved for women and the resultant disincentives for MPs to nure their constitutencies, Mr Moily said, "But you should understand, in a parliamentary democracy, it is the privilege of the people to elect, not the privilege of the person to get elected. You should understand that."

He went on to say that the suggestion that the new system would create such a disincentive was "far fetched."

"We have experimented it in local boards under the 73rd and 74th Constitution [amendment]. Such rotation is allowed and is working very well. And millions and millions of [women] representatives at the grassroots level, this has proved success, why not here?" he said.

Mr Moily said the Lok Sabha had the right to amend the Bill. "Ultimately, after all, each house is powerful, absolutely, on its own right. That is the sovereign right of Parliament," he said.

At the same time, he said that, though India was the largest democracy, it had not become an inclusive democracy because women were kept out. "That is the greatest deficit that we are suffering today. We need to correct it. How you are going to correct it is for the Parliament to decide," he said.

Asked why the consultations that the Government had promised in the Lok Sabha had not been conducted before the vote in the Rajya Sabha, Mr Moily said consultations had gone onf or more than 25 years, especially in the last 15 years.

He said the Bill was drafted on the basis of convergence of views and after it had been approved by the Parliamentary Standing Committee.

He said Finance Minister Pranab Mukherjee's offer of consultations was aimed at taking everybody on board. "That's why, in the Lok Sabha, we want to reduce the friction and friction can be reduced in so many ways," he said.

Mr Moily said the Bill had been passed by the Rajya Sabha with an overwhelming majority and it was likely to be passed by a similar majority in the Lower House.

He said the fact that the Lok Sabha could amend the Bill, in theory, did not mean that the Government had decided to send it back. "No. This is not the decision, as on today, of the parliament, to send it back," he said. Asked if he was holding out the possibility that that could happen, he said, "No".

"In a consultation process, even if one man is dissenting, the idea is to talk to him. Just because we are talking to some people; just because we are talking to one or two individuals, that doesn't mean that one or two or few people's opinion should prevail over the majority opinion passed by the Rajya Sabha and the majority national consensus which has been arrived after a due consultation, after a due process of debate all over the country all these 15 years," he said.

He said that, by opening up consultations and discussions at each stage, eve at the last stage of passage of the Bill, the Government was not displaying weakness but its democratic responses.

To a question about the purpose of discussion if the Government was not prepared to change its mind, he said, "You must understand, there are certain issues and concerns which are raised by them. They feel strongly. That has to be done. We want a smooth sail of the bill."

He said Congress President Sonia Gandhi, the UPA, and other parties such as the Bharatiya Janata Party and many other parties and individuals were totally committed to the Bill in its present form.

Mr Moily denied that the Congress was caught between the "triumph" that Ms Gandhi had claimed after the Bill was passed by the Rajya Sabha and losing its majority in the Lok Sabha if it tried to push the legislative through in its present form.

"No, we are not caught. We are very confident on the ground," he said, adding that he did not think any party had withdrawn support on the issue.

He said that there would be apprehensions in the transitional period when reforms such as this were carried out.

Asked about when the Government would like the Bill to be passed by the Lok Sabha, he said, "We would like to pass it in the present session; either in the first part or the second part."

To a question about whether he could guarantee this, he said, "Yeah. We are very confident on that...We are very confident on the ground."

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Photo courtesy CNN-IBN.